Nitestorm
03-06-2001, 01:11
Both use Tonicom branded 6.0ns memory chips made by ACTRAM (http://www.actram.com). In theory, all of them use the same memory chips and thus should all overclock to 183Mhz@Cas3 and 166Mhz@Cas2. However, there are some that don't seem to overclock as well and seem more like 166Mhz@Cas3 and 150Mhz@Cas2. So you need to be careful which type you buy.
Tonicom (http://www.tonicomdram.com) SIM BGA PC-166
http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/memory/images/010525tinicom/box.jpg
http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/memory/images/010525tinicom/tonicom.jpg
With Tonicom they seem to label both types as 'SIM BGA PC-166', so you have to be extra careful to make sure you get the 183Mhz@Cas3 one. Tonicom seem to be doing new packaging that specifically states if the memory can do 183Mhz (see pic above). The older packaging (see here (http://www.overclocker.com.tw/article/0103/pc166_1.jpg)) only states PC-166 and thus is probably only rated 166Mhz@Cas3 and 150Mhz@Cas2. ACTRAM/Tonicom have offices in Taipei, Hong Kong, USA and Germany (http://www.actcts.com/ACT%20E/index.htm).
OCZ (http://www.overclockerz.com) MicroBGA PC180
http://www.hardwareoc.com/pc180pics/pc180.JPG
OCZ take a different way of telling the difference. They pre-tested some up to 183Mhz@Cas3 and sell them as PC180 modules and the ones that only do 166Mhz@Cas3 are sold as PC166 modules. So getting the PC180 modules would be more worthwhile. OCZ are based in the US and are looking for resellers of their products.
Reaching 183Mhz FSB
Had a talk to Mortin who did the review (http://www.icrontic.com/?action=hardware&id=50) over at icrontic where he got the KT7A-R with Tonicom PC166 up to 183Mhz FSB. He said he has tested a good few sticks of Tonicom PC166 all rated Cas3 and he has yet to see one that doesn't do 183Mhz, Cas3. Infact he has got this stuff to run TURBO, Cas3 at 183Mhz. He also holds the view, if people can't reach as high as the memory is rated, it's more to do with their system not capable of such speeds, rather than the memory failing. This can be due to the chipset failing (an increase in Vio and extra cooling might help) but also pci/agp cards failing (see PCI Primer (http://www.overclockers.com/pci)).
One of the reviews that got up to 183Mhz with their KT7A-R lowered the multipler by 3-4x from default (to remove any processor limitation), set Vio to 3.9v, used the slowest memory settings and set the following in the BIOS:
Fast CPU command decode - normal
Dram 4k-Page Mode - Disable
DRAM Timing - 8/10ns
DRAM Bank Interleave - Disable
Delay DRAM Read Latch - AUTO
SDRAM Cycle Length - 3
AGP 4X Mode - Disable
Ultra DMA mode - Disable
While all the reviews that got to 183Mhz had to disable UDMA, AGP4x, run slowest memory settings and CPU command decode as normal, only one of them mentions the Vio. But I'd guess all max'd the Vio to 3.9v. Increasing the Vio will help the chipset, memory and pci/agp cards run at higher speeds, but also increases heat produced by them. No mention of any extra motherboard cooling, but probably a good idea if you want to run at a Vio of 3.9v, which is kind of risky. Certainly add a better chipset cooler onto the northbridge with some silver thermal compound. Maybe add one to the southbridge as well and add ramsinks onto the PLL (clock generator) chip and MOSFETS.
Reviews
FYI here is the list of reviews I have found so far, although some do say they suspect it was the rest of their system stopping them reaching higher speeds rather than the memory:
OCZ MicroBGA PC180
hardwareoc.com (http://www.hardwareoc.com/oczpc180.php) - ( 163Mhz@Cas2 )
OCZ MicroBGA PC166 cluboverclocker.com (http://www.cluboverclocker.com/reviews/memory/ocz_micro_bga_pc166/index.htm) - ( 166Mhz@Cas2 )
jsihardware.com (http://www.jsihardware.com/hardware/memory/ocz/micro%20bga%20pc-166/index.shtml) - ( 160Mhz@Cas2 )
overclockers.com (http://www.overclockers.com/articles386/) - ( 152Mhz@Cas2 )
ipkonfig.com (http://www.ipkonfig.com/reviews/OCZ-MBGA-PC150) - ( 153Mhz@Cas2 )
technoyard.com (http://www.technoyard.com/hardware/memory/150-microBGA/page_1.html) - ( 166Mhz@Cas2 )
rizenet.com (http://www.rizenet.com/hardware/oczmicro150/page1.php) - ( 160Mhz@Cas2 )
Tonicom SIM BGA PC166 transparentpixel.com (http://www.transparentpixel.com/reviews/pc166/pc166intro.htm) - ( 153Mhz@Cas2?)
overclocker.com.tw (http://www.overclocker.com.tw/article/0103/readgoodarticle.asp?id=301) - ( 155Mhz@Cas2, 180Mhz@Cas3 )
pconline.com.cn (http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/memory/010525tinicomx1.htm) - ( 158Mhz@Cas2, 183Mhz@Cas3 )
icrontic.com (http://www.icrontic.com/?action=hardware&id=50) - ( 183Mhz@Cas3 )
ocworkbench.com (http://www.ocworkbench.com/articles/kt7a183/kt7a183.htm) - ( 183Mhz@Cas3 )
[ 03 June 2001: Message edited by: Nitestorm ]
Tonicom (http://www.tonicomdram.com) SIM BGA PC-166
http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/memory/images/010525tinicom/box.jpg
http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/memory/images/010525tinicom/tonicom.jpg
With Tonicom they seem to label both types as 'SIM BGA PC-166', so you have to be extra careful to make sure you get the 183Mhz@Cas3 one. Tonicom seem to be doing new packaging that specifically states if the memory can do 183Mhz (see pic above). The older packaging (see here (http://www.overclocker.com.tw/article/0103/pc166_1.jpg)) only states PC-166 and thus is probably only rated 166Mhz@Cas3 and 150Mhz@Cas2. ACTRAM/Tonicom have offices in Taipei, Hong Kong, USA and Germany (http://www.actcts.com/ACT%20E/index.htm).
OCZ (http://www.overclockerz.com) MicroBGA PC180
http://www.hardwareoc.com/pc180pics/pc180.JPG
OCZ take a different way of telling the difference. They pre-tested some up to 183Mhz@Cas3 and sell them as PC180 modules and the ones that only do 166Mhz@Cas3 are sold as PC166 modules. So getting the PC180 modules would be more worthwhile. OCZ are based in the US and are looking for resellers of their products.
Reaching 183Mhz FSB
Had a talk to Mortin who did the review (http://www.icrontic.com/?action=hardware&id=50) over at icrontic where he got the KT7A-R with Tonicom PC166 up to 183Mhz FSB. He said he has tested a good few sticks of Tonicom PC166 all rated Cas3 and he has yet to see one that doesn't do 183Mhz, Cas3. Infact he has got this stuff to run TURBO, Cas3 at 183Mhz. He also holds the view, if people can't reach as high as the memory is rated, it's more to do with their system not capable of such speeds, rather than the memory failing. This can be due to the chipset failing (an increase in Vio and extra cooling might help) but also pci/agp cards failing (see PCI Primer (http://www.overclockers.com/pci)).
One of the reviews that got up to 183Mhz with their KT7A-R lowered the multipler by 3-4x from default (to remove any processor limitation), set Vio to 3.9v, used the slowest memory settings and set the following in the BIOS:
Fast CPU command decode - normal
Dram 4k-Page Mode - Disable
DRAM Timing - 8/10ns
DRAM Bank Interleave - Disable
Delay DRAM Read Latch - AUTO
SDRAM Cycle Length - 3
AGP 4X Mode - Disable
Ultra DMA mode - Disable
While all the reviews that got to 183Mhz had to disable UDMA, AGP4x, run slowest memory settings and CPU command decode as normal, only one of them mentions the Vio. But I'd guess all max'd the Vio to 3.9v. Increasing the Vio will help the chipset, memory and pci/agp cards run at higher speeds, but also increases heat produced by them. No mention of any extra motherboard cooling, but probably a good idea if you want to run at a Vio of 3.9v, which is kind of risky. Certainly add a better chipset cooler onto the northbridge with some silver thermal compound. Maybe add one to the southbridge as well and add ramsinks onto the PLL (clock generator) chip and MOSFETS.
Reviews
FYI here is the list of reviews I have found so far, although some do say they suspect it was the rest of their system stopping them reaching higher speeds rather than the memory:
OCZ MicroBGA PC180
hardwareoc.com (http://www.hardwareoc.com/oczpc180.php) - ( 163Mhz@Cas2 )
OCZ MicroBGA PC166 cluboverclocker.com (http://www.cluboverclocker.com/reviews/memory/ocz_micro_bga_pc166/index.htm) - ( 166Mhz@Cas2 )
jsihardware.com (http://www.jsihardware.com/hardware/memory/ocz/micro%20bga%20pc-166/index.shtml) - ( 160Mhz@Cas2 )
overclockers.com (http://www.overclockers.com/articles386/) - ( 152Mhz@Cas2 )
ipkonfig.com (http://www.ipkonfig.com/reviews/OCZ-MBGA-PC150) - ( 153Mhz@Cas2 )
technoyard.com (http://www.technoyard.com/hardware/memory/150-microBGA/page_1.html) - ( 166Mhz@Cas2 )
rizenet.com (http://www.rizenet.com/hardware/oczmicro150/page1.php) - ( 160Mhz@Cas2 )
Tonicom SIM BGA PC166 transparentpixel.com (http://www.transparentpixel.com/reviews/pc166/pc166intro.htm) - ( 153Mhz@Cas2?)
overclocker.com.tw (http://www.overclocker.com.tw/article/0103/readgoodarticle.asp?id=301) - ( 155Mhz@Cas2, 180Mhz@Cas3 )
pconline.com.cn (http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/memory/010525tinicomx1.htm) - ( 158Mhz@Cas2, 183Mhz@Cas3 )
icrontic.com (http://www.icrontic.com/?action=hardware&id=50) - ( 183Mhz@Cas3 )
ocworkbench.com (http://www.ocworkbench.com/articles/kt7a183/kt7a183.htm) - ( 183Mhz@Cas3 )
[ 03 June 2001: Message edited by: Nitestorm ]