Remastered AC/DC albums...warning

[DT1]

I've been ripping some AC/DC albums, you've probably seen them, they're the remastered versions with the sleeve notes and all.

I ripped them to flac using dBpoweramp and when I listening to them, talk about clipping and distortion... :mad:

I opened up Cooledit Pro and looked at the waveform and there is a serious amount of clipping on the ripped flac. Maybe it's a dBpoweramp problem I thought, so I ripped again using Cooledit but, no, there is still a lot of clipping.

A bit annoyed by this I looked at some older AC/DC CD albums, i.e. not the remastered version, and...no clipping!!!! :confused:

So if anybody is an AC/DC fan I would seriously recommend that you buy the non remastered CD's, you might not get the sleeve notes but the music quality is a lot better (if you like AC/DC). :p

The other thing that I found was that my JVC bookshelf speakers can handle AC/DC a lot better than my Logitech 560's (THX or not). :)

[TheFallenAngel]

perhaps you have a Normalize setting ticked or something.

AC/DC rock...I own all albums anyway so not likely to be going out getting the new one although even at a fiver they are tempting.

Back in Black/If you want blood/For those about to rock/powerage/HTH

for a fiver each... god darn thats a good deal.

[digit]

it could possibly be to do with your sound card .... along with settings in your program that arent being ticked or unticked as required ...

[Slamdog]

I'll stick to my vinyl copies of them all......

[Laurence G]

I'm probally going to purchase a copy, I'll see how mine rip.
I use DB PowerAmp DMC (vbr 160- 225)
Never had anything clip. Hmmm odd. :eek:

[TheFallenAngel]

I use Easy Cd Extractor and never had a problem with it.
I use 250kbit VBR High Quality option.

[Neo Master Kill]

you will prob say "N00B" to this but couldnt it be copyright protection that may be guffing it up when your try to put in onto your computer, have you tried playing them normally??

[Dunc]

Its a problem with all of these remastered copies of classic albums that are coming out. I had the exact same problem with the remastered Iron Maiden albums.
As far as I can tell all they do is whack the volume up. Its a universal diference in modern mastering technique to how it was done in the 80's. For some reason modern mastering is just way louder. Go have a look on the hydrogenaudio forums and you'll find loads of similar complaints

[DT1]

I'll stick to my vinyl copies of them all......

I've got all of them on vinyl too, but the needle skips when I'm in the car...:)

Thanks Dunc, I'll do that.

Looks like I'll have to record from vinyl and clean it up with Cooledit then, which is the reason I bought the CD's in the first place, so that I wouldn't have to spend time doing that.

Cooledit and Sonicfury are a good combination for just about anything and it is just these remastered CD's that are causing problems. Maybe that's why they're so cheap.

[Neo Master Kill]

I have a couple of Emerson Lake and Palmer remastered albums and have had no problems with it

[DT1]

And?

I was talking about the AC/DC remastered albums which do clip.

[Neo Master Kill]

Its a problem with all of these remastered copies of classic albums that are coming out.

I was talking to him.

[DT1]

Oh OK. :)

Peace.

[Dunc]

So there are exceptions, big deal. Its still a major problem

And sort out that sig will you, its really taking the rise. Read the rules. I'm surprised no one has mentioned it before.

[Big Adam]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned it before.I have.
And action is being taken........

[Dunc]

Good stuff. That word of mine you edited, fair enough, but is it just me that finds that bit of the censor a bit OTT?

[Trojan]

soundforge has a pluggin called 'clip peak restoration', surely cooledit would have something similar???

[DT1]

Yes it does, if it is just the odd clip then fine, but I am talking about virtually the entire track being clipped. So much so, in fact, the waveform looks like a big block of green with no peaks and troughs.

Nor am I talking about one track but an entire album.

[Dunc]

It sounds like that is a particularly bad example, but as i'm sure you have seen from the HA forums, its not uncommon.

[DT1]

Well, looking through that forum it seems that Sony are well known for this practice. Guess who made these remastered albums!

It's really annoying; that's why we have volume controls. I don't need some sound engineer to do it for me at the expense of quality.

Edit: This is really starting to annoy me the more I think about it, and I don't want to start ranting or the thread will get moved. :p :D

[Dunc]

One thing that really highlights how bad the problem is getting is replaygain (http://www.replaygain.org/) in foobar2k. Replaygain is a thing that scans the album, and assigns a volume reduction or increase level to it. This means all your mp3's or whatever play at approximately the same volume

Most albums are usually set around the -2 to -4dB mark, but albums more recently have been coming up as -9, -10 or even -11dB. If anyone who knows how sound levels actually work will realise, that's an enormous difference.

Accounts from the actual sound engineers themselves say it is the record label suits who are forcing the volumes louder and louder for some reason. There are stories of correctly mastered albums being rejected and sent back because they are 'too quiet'. Apparently that's what the customer wants :mad:

[DT1]

Well, here is a pic of Soulstripper on Cooledit.

In replaygain it was -10.53db!

[Dunc]

I just ripped Iron Maidens 'Can I Play with Madness', off both an original and remastered copy of 'Seventh Son of a Seventh Son'. The remastered copy is the bottom one, it kind of speaks for itself.

http://www.duncb.co.uk/images/madness.jpg

How that can be seen as an improvement I'll never know :rolleyes:

[Laurence G]

Just looks like its been compressed and limited...

[DT1]

You have to wonder if it's actually legal.

[TheFallenAngel]

Are you sure your software isnt doing something to it as it rips it.

I use an old version of Easy Cd Extractor for ripping, 4.6 if i remember.
Works just fine.
Get a whole cd in 250kbit VBR or whatever I want, ogg mpc.
Whole disc in about 2.5 minutes with my Plextor.

[Dunc]

If it was doing something, it would do it to both cd's. This has nothing to do with the ripping software.

I dont think you really 'get' what we are talking about here.

[DT1]

It's not the ripping that is the problem, it's these remastered CD's.

As Dunc showed, get an old CD and a remastered CD and look at the difference.

The worst of it is, you can't buy non-remastered copies anymore.

[TheFallenAngel]

I do get what you are talking about just makin sure u werent making an **** of the ripping.

[Laurence G]

So, is the file audibly distored on playback?
Is it distorted when played in a hi-fi cd player?

Its hard to tell from a WaveForm, as it could of easy been heavily compressed, and limited. Which would maximize the levels, and reduce the range.

[Dunc]

When played on my (reasonably good) hifi, there are some definite points on the remastered maiden albums where it clips so badly there is a slight crackle. Overall though, it just doesnt sound right compared to the originals. I have got pretty sensitive ears, and would probably be described as an audiophile, so some may not even notice it. The difference in volume is also obviously pretty big.

When ripped it just compounds it, and they sound lousy regardless of the format or ripping method.

This is all subjective of course..

[Laurence G]

Hmmm, I'll try and get hold the real cd and run its though our studio/hi-fi monitors. They are quite revealing... Sounds like its been badly mastered, mastering is a bit of a black art.

Have you tried ripping as a Raw/PCM file?
Might be better off sticking to the orginal...

[Dunc]

Its a pretty universal thing that has been going on for a while now. Studio's are driving up the volume more and more at the cost of quality. To the average person, a louder recording sounds 'better'. It also helps on the radio when all your records sound louder than the competition.

Most of this is done against the wishes of the sound engineer, and the order comes from up on high.

It's a fairly hotly discussed topic if you search around a bit, here's a quite interesting link

http://www.digido.com/portal/pmodule_id=11/pmdmode=fullscreen/pageadder_page_id=93/

[Laurence G]

Interesting link, cheers...

I've read quite a few threads regarding this in the SoundonSound forums (www.sospubs.co.uk) Last time I heard, they where planning to setup a sub forums just for talking about CD's and there production...

I thought a majority of radio stations, compressed all there tracks again on playback, and some even speed them up. On a cheap radio theres considerable distortion anyway, its only when you listen to these things on a very good setup that you hear the errors...

Just looking though what AC/DC I do have, the newest is 1994.

[DT1]

They are probably OK then, I have some CD's from before the, so called, remastered versions and they are fine.

[Savage]

I've got all of them on vinyl too, but the needle skips when I'm in the car...:)


did anybody ever see those incar record players absolutly terrible for your records.